Unisin

Join Date 07/2008

Sinful Suggestions

Hi all,

I know there are other lists of suggestions but these I have not seen (maybe missed; in which case feel free to ignore superfluous parts).

Do please add your own, but try to give some reasoning behind it. Merely stating ‘I want new ships types’ or ‘improve the sounds’ is not adding anything 8-).

Also please do not start arguments; this is supposed to be a list for Stardock to decide on, not a spot to argue whether or not something should be in. Personally I always promote option: never less, always more, when it comes to choices.

Please refer to specific points with their ref #.

Ok then, let’s start with the complex one.

1) I think one of the more disappointing and very fixable issues would be that combat is rather frenzied yet static and requires either meticulous micromanagement (which the speed of the game does not really allow for) or just a rather generalistic fleet-vs-fleet clash approach (everyone target that Cap/Hoshi etc.) in the current setup. In order to give peeps more influence on how to conduct a battle, three things immediately come to mind: two below (combo) and one as separate point (#2).

First of all implement (sounds easy hmm? - I know it is not…) the already suggested Combat Attitude/Stance: Aggressive/Defensive/Protective/Scout etc. (I would also promote ‘Taunt’ and ‘Harass’ settings).

At the same time, put much more freedom into ‘levelling’ your cap ships since currently all L10 caps are 3-3-3-1 which means you only decide the order in which they develop certain areas - a minimal influence at best (and none at all in the end; you should start with little ‘direction’, and end with maximum differentiation I think). Now if you combine these two, you can build (I prefer to take TEC examples since they are straighforward, but am not blind to the fact many more complex balances will need extensive re-configuration for this type of change) a fleet that really has individual style: say you make 1 tank Kol on Stand Ground & Taunt, then 2 offensive Cap’s behind on Defensive Guard (so they don’t move off too far; not sure if cohesion should override stance), and you put your Dunov on Protect/Chicken etc.

We should really have a setting for all caps ships to Flee (nearest phase line or phase-line-last-used, I would really like that last option on Retreat as well) at either 0% shield or 50% health (as done very well in Warlords Battlecry III).

Then, you have some influence on the battlefield, and you also take away the MP dogma ‘always go for the enemy cap first’ if you play it right…hopefully.

It is specifically the combination of these elements that would make combat and therefore, the whole game, much more enjoyable I think.

Btw, if I make a tank, maybe it should be slower to accelerate and stop (et cetera ad nauseam).

2) At which time I should mention that for point 1 to work and in general, for large scenarios to still work well, it would be rather nice to have the simple elegance of 0.50% and 0.25% speed settings. Fast games can be fun (I often 2x it) but you get so much more depth and have such an easier time learning the game if things can be slowed down. I never did understand why a few games only have multipliers, not dividers…must be a really cheap calculator .

3) I think in multiplayer, speed settings should be part of the options before you start…some peeps want the whole MP game in 4x speed (speed-chess; quite nerve-wrecking) and while this is not generally my style, I think many would like the option. Quicky-Sins! (No you can have the TM for that.)

4) While realizing planet development was never meant to be within the scope of Sins, I find the whole ‘space development only’ thing rather narrow. You have made an impressive, one might argue (with the implementation of fleet-info icons around gravity wells and such) spectacular zoom-all-the-way game environment and I think my immersion would greatly benefit if I could zoom in all the way to a planet’s surface and do things there. Not many things - that would shift focus too much. You could then even do ground attacks next, but I realize this may be an expansion-pack or Sins II type change. Still…breathing some life into planets (if only to find goodies/baddies…send down scout parties recover umm…mini(arti)facts?) would add ambiance I think.

No, minifact is mine, can’t have it .

5) Where are the polls on this website? They are in my view conspicuously absent. A company that promotes the Bill of Rights should not appear not to listen to players. Ask us what we think of the way in which the game should go - if you put together polls yourself, chances are you actually get answers you can use…and you can do it at times when the ‘newsfeed’ appears to be...hibernating (you should never keep the same message at the top for more than 7 days I think).

6) The predictability of Random Systems is beginning to seriously degrade my game fun. I am I phear an explorer at heart and the last time we started a random game I immediately knew where everyone was as soon as I saw my position towards the sun. Bad. I would really like to have (as many 4X titles but also games like say Age of Empires etc. offer) a wide choice in settings concerning what the galaxy will look like. Everything from phase line density to chances of Artifacts and specific research ‘concerns’.

7) Now this has probably been asked a hundred times, I just want to add the example: CoX* probably holds the world record when it comes to customizing ‘the outside’. In Sins I would expect decals, texture choices, ship model choices, and yes most of all, the ability to off-line (or in some ingenious way you may yet think of, in-game) ‘design your own’. Anything from the relatively simple Sword of the Stars modular type development, to the in-depth choices of games like Master of Orion 2 and Pax Imperia.

No, I refuse to use the word ‘skins’, I am too old for this particular linguistic anomaly .

*City of Heroes/Villains.

8) I like smaller games as much as I like huge ones. Can we, pretty-please with space-debris on top, have more freedom in setting max-ships and such? Cap-ships only; other restrictions.

Don’t worry, even if with a small fleet (say 25 or 50 ships max in game…per side that is) you will not really ‘need’ it I will still buy Entrench - and even with small fleets the mini-expansion will by the looks of it be more than useful seeing the upgrade notions and such. And after: well the cost could be prohitive but if not, look at the WBC3 ‘rules’ options: No Dragons, No Towers, etc. How about No Starbases (as option!)

9) And for my final trick today - yes it is easy to just think up stuff I know but I really want to keep the ‘suggestions’ thing rolling it is as essential to the longevity of this game as the mods & modders are - I suggest a UI improvement.

Many of us run much higher than 1024x768 (I run 2560x1600, for instance, and only know one person with a 17”) and I have oodles of space that is unused and that could be used very well for say, most particularly, a miniature (well 4 parts, for the 4 main subjects, might be best) Research interface. I would rather like to have it in-game all the time.

Dear folk, the research screen is the only screen Sins still puts up as a temporary ‘blind’ and for anyone who bought the game (haven’t we all…) the simplest representation of the full research lines (small, without text even, just tiny open-box type icons in the right spot that you can ‘check’) will be enough to make the choices without blotting our screen. After all, we have the research map that came with the box to consult…and for those who bought it online without box you can always get this in printable version I trust?

With this, high-resolution players can make use of open space, and lower-rez players can choose to not have the system that blocks their view.

And yes, we want hotkeys to place or hide those spankynew Research ‘hot-screens’. I think they can be made in the same general style (but more miniaturized) as the ‘new’ Market/Pirate interface bit.

Well that oughtta keep you ‘Dockies off the street for a bit

As always, thanks for a wonderful game,

Lucas aka Sinful

PS Edits by me never on content, only typo's/style etc.

* ...; for the eye sees not itself,

* But by reflection, by some other things.

* Julius Caesar

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Addition to point #7: if you allow us to put our Empire's THEME (logo) on a ship (and maybe colors?) you will make the whole 'Cinematic mode' much more feasible to use.

Lucas aka Sinful

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Concerning point #1: in retrospect I suspect this improvement will not so much reduce the MP tactic of going for Player Capships. I think it will do even better: make Caps, without overpowering them, so much more useful and fun that peeps will start building them again in MP.

At least that is one more consideration I would keep in the back of my mind, if I were a 'Dockie

Lucas aka Sinful

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ad 6) there is a map generator in game, where you can have more or less semi-random maps. its not perfect, but maybe it can do some of the stuff you want. also, there is a big chunk of user made maps if you grow tired of what is already in there.

ad 9) did you ever play imperium glactica II? this game had a quick research option, by which you clicked on a small button and then it displayed a list of items available for research. no graphics, no descriptions, but if you already knew what you were going to do it was sufficient. it was a bit like the start button in the lower left corner of windows. press, look at the list, pick what you want and be done with it. so, if you leave out all the fancy graphics, descriptions categories and what not, that could work. provided it is something enough people want. I'd say its not a bad idea.

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Hi all, Shadowhal,

#6) User maps good notion but I am (perhaps wrongfully?) assuming they won't work with beta's? Certainly something for later...but it does not quite do the job.

My main issue is that if the game has no campaign, it should at least have a good map generator (not editor) to allow for diversity. I can only determine size, # of player & pirate toggle right now? I really think it should allow for *much* more liberty. Like a random (0 to 70 at first) setting for AI player diplo-stance, so they are not of necessity all enemies at start. Also a much more random placement of (all) players. And many things from phase line 'density' to planet-type bias. Throw in some major 'shape' options (as most 4X titles do) like Spiral and Elliptical galaxies, and preferably some options for state-of-exploration and state-of-research, and you would have a decent start.

#9) Imp Gal II 4CD box 3 inches from my left knee

Keeping it short: in order to better help Sins (good excuse hmm?) I am re-playing nearly all my old 4X, as well as some new ones.

For the research in Sins, seeing how some projects are 3-step, I suggest small dark boxes/icons that turn red if you have 1-of-3 steps researched, yellow on 2-of-3 or 1-of-2, and green when fully done; sound about right?

Lucas aka Sinful

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Once, ironclad put together the campaign, it would be cool to have a campaign editor (I saw Shadowhal suggesting sth like that in another threat and I think this would be really cool!). Make your own maps, put them together, have some text pop ups for story writing and there you go!

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Hi all,

#10) Basically an 'extension' of what is under #1, but an essential point for making combat more purposeful, controllable, and logical I think: add an Attack Focus option to whatever selection of ships you have made. So if I 'Select all Cap ships' (another setting, yes hmm) I should be able to tell them to 'Attack whatever has the highest damage output'. I should then for instance be able to 'Select all LRM frigs' and tell them to 'Shoot at whatever enemy is healing another enemy'. I should also be able to say if a ship selection (or full fleet of course) should ignore or include 'Neutrals' like Pirates.

#11) I thought about the interface some more. In order to make the whole thing with all the 'Fleet & Ship Commands' work on lower screen resolutions, one might need a Combat-Overlay interface/HUD: one that is the same shape as the basic upper and lower 'bars' but with a (mostly) different set of icons and commands. As I recall (The Saga of) Ryzom has a very interesting system where you can have (F1 through F4 if I have it right) 4 different interface screens, and there they are fully configurable as well. The default hotkey for such an overlay-toggle (!) would probably have to be 'Space bar'.

The alternative would be a vertical bar on the right-hand side of the window, since this is about the only spot not occupied on lower res screens atm?

Good luck,

Lucas aka Sinful

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#1 I fully agree on this. I have long wanted total control and diverity among my fleet (I have pages and pages of stuff typed up I just have yet to post it on the forum).

#7 As for customization, I do indeed think the preset logos you choose from should act like your team colors when it comes to frigates, cap ships and structures. I would much rather have it emblazoned on the side of the ship then as a floating icon that marks it as yours. "Create your own X" sounds fun but I'd like it to stay within bounderies. for instance say we keep all the Cap ship bodies the same but based on the amount of creds, crystal, metal, you can buff its starting stats, or give it certain abilities (how bout havin' Kol's lvl 6 ability be Missile Barrage? it is in my current mod and it's friggin awesome).

#6 I feel ya. I figured out how to make sure there's no one else in my system on the huge multi random maps. I know where the usuall four wormholes are, etc, etc. I would much rather have truely random maps then randomly generated from a preset.

#9 I actually disagree. I run 1650x180 and enjpoy the large amounts of space. In large battles it becomes fun because I can more easily direct my different fleets to their combat zones. Now concerning a "List" as Shadowhal suggested, there is a gap on the top hud between your name and where the options begin. maybe fill that slot with a "research" button that scrolls through images of the researches to better amplify what you want to use? It could give everyone something that way those who like it can click and scrooll, meanwhile those of us who like the large research trees can just ignore the button.

Well there's my input and praise.

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I had a few of my own ideas. Playing the game, I have found there are a two changes I would make to the design of the game in a future expansion.

1. Create a separate fleet supply for capital ships. Basically keep the current fleet supply the same for everything else and add fleet supply for cap ships that is researched separately. In big games it seems that when I am trying to decide to a)build 1 capital ship, b)build 5 heavy cruisers, c)6 carriers or d)something else, it usually happens I go with b, c or d. This basically makes capital ships worthless. A level one capital ship is worthless and the time it takes to level them up versus having a bunch more frigates or cruisers makes it pointless to build capital ships. Creating a separate fleet supply just for capital ships would create larger fleets (fun for everybody), and create different strategies to employ involving capital ships.

2. Make pirate raid sizes proportional to bounty, with a cap at say 100000. In large games when I have maxed out the number of ships I can build, the only leverage that exists in the game are the pirates, because essentially you fight to a standstill with huge fleets. Since towards the end of the game most pirate raids are all about the same size, its pretty easy to defend planets. Making the pirate raid sizes proportional to bounty size you have another weapon that you can used to kill your opponent.

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